The Future of TPA

The time of xbox360 and ps3 is running out and i personally don’t think FS will continue to develop dlcs after the next generations hit the road.

I mean there are so many names of pinball tables floating around the board that i was wondering how long will TPA really exist (at least on the two big consoles)?
And how many of these tables are we actually going to see on xbox 360 and ps3? 20, 50, 100?
And how long can a pinball game really be attractive? (to the masses of course, i don’t talk about the several hundred pinball nerds).
Is it really possible (economical wise) to recreate all these tables?

If they really recreate 2 tables every month this would be approximately 40 tables till the next generations arrive.

What do you think about it?

As long as people buy it, they will keep making tables. The user base can only grow, as time goes on. Perhaps once this current generation of devices retire, Farsight can give back to everone who purchased all the tables for one device, a discount code for the game when it is released in the newer generation game platform. IOS and android is safe since tables go with accounts.

If they don't take the necessary measures to make TPA playable on the next-gen consoles, that game won't last long. I haven't seen any signs that they may want to release a disc some day, but who knows?
Pinball Arcade: The Williams, Bally, Stern & Gottlieb Collection??

IOS, Android, PC they are all safe - but the consoles? i don't think so. And maybe they don't even devolpe tables for the next generations because the whole thing stops after 14 tables. The problem is, i don't think it pays off if only WE (the pinball nerds) buy the tables and that's the BIG BIG BIG problem. As soon as it gets boring to the average XBLA-Games-Collector it will pretty much stop. The next problem is, for the casual "let's play a quick pinball game" guy - there is no difference between PFX2 and TAP - even worse - PFX2 is way more "interesting" to these people.

I really have a bad feeling about that, i really hope to see as many tables possible until the bubble bursts.

I wouldn't worry about this. Whatever the next gen console from Sony is going to be... I'm sure it will have access to the PSN network and store. And I don't see why this new console shouldn't be backwards compatible to all the downloadable games. Because if it isn't they could just as well throw pretty much all of the content of the store out of the window.

Urhm. On second thought however... this might just as well be the very thing they plan to do?

you are right the games may be backwards compatible but the main problem will be to stay attractive (to the masses) - maybe once the pc version is out and cabinet mode (which is a very, very, very important and essential feature to seperate from the competitors) is available the whole thing will get a lift off but till then i think it will be pretty hard to survive.

When the new consoles come out, I expect FarSight to release The Pinball Arcade 2 with more realistic graphics and physics. They should be able to keep making new tables and upgrading the tables from The Pinball Arcade without having to rebuild them from the ground up. They can release the upgraded TPA tables in bulk packs at a discounted price.

yes that's a possibility but only if the manage to stay (or become) attractive to the casual player and if they manage to overtake PFX2,3,4,5... with special features like the cabinet view. So i think they should really focus on such things and they should really try to implement some of PFX2's advantages like the multiplayer splitscreen.

Lets not start etching the gravestone just yet. Remember that Pinball FX has been around for over 5 years and still going strong. As has been mentioned in this thread when the next generation of consoles rolls out there is no reason to think TPA will not be compatible from day 1. And of course, the new hardware will lead to an opportunity to make an improved version of the game (TPA 2). The key to holding the interest of the masses is continued support both in terms of updates to the game and DLC. Every time a new DLC hits PBFX you see a huge increase in the number of people playing the game. Adding new tables on a regular basis will keep casual players interested as well as the serious pinballers assuming the tables are sold for a reasonable price.

And it's up to us pinball crazies to be walking advertisements for the game.

Etching the gravestone? We're still not even out of the hospital with the new baby yet!

I'm assuming FarSight will do two things when the new consoles hit:

• Assuming the new consoles can play old XBLA/PSN titles (and it would be stupid if they couldn't), continue to offer DLC for the existing game through XBLA and PSN, until FarSight can...
• Release TPA2 for the new consoles and then either allow TPA2 to play TPA DLC (sort of like what Zen is doing now) or offer upgraded tables at a big discount for owners of the previous version.

I'm not seeing much cause for concern here.

Kaoru said:

I wouldn't worry about this. Whatever the next gen console from Sony is going to be... I'm sure it will have access to the PSN network and store. And I don't see why this new console shouldn't be backwards compatible to all the downloadable games. Because if it isn't they could just as well throw pretty much all of the content of the store out of the window.

Urhm. On second thought however... this might just as well be the very thing they plan to do?

Click to expand...

Sony has already said the PS4 will not be backwards compatible, and the 360 never was (they did do software emulations of several original XBOX games, but almost all had issues, and some were completely broken). Why allow content transfers when they can simply make everyone re-buy their old content?
On the good side, as mentioned elsewhere, Zen has been around 5 years and is still going strong, and their program has never been as good as TPA, especially when it launched. TPA is already planned for the first next-gen system, Wii-U, so it won't be too much of a stretch to believe they won't also hit the other consoles when they launch.
The transition always takes time, as consoles are prohibitively expensive at launch, and we are in the worst economy since the great depression. Even if it recovers, many will still be deeply in debt, and not have the money for a pricey new console. Then there were the well-publicized technical problems the first-generation consoles had (especially the 360). There are features the new consoles are rumored to have, such as content licenses, that are already upsetting people. If the consoles launch with these (which they most likely will), it could also negatively affect sales.

Serenseven said:

Etching the gravestone? We're still not even out of the hospital with the new baby yet!

I'm assuming FarSight will do two things when the new consoles hit:

• Assuming the new consoles can play old XBLA/PSN titles (and it would be stupid if they couldn't), continue to offer DLC for the existing game through XBLA and PSN, until FarSight can...
• Release TPA2 for the new consoles and then either allow TPA2 to play TPA DLC (sort of like what Zen is doing now) or offer upgraded tables at a big discount for owners of the previous version.

I'm not seeing much cause for concern here.

Click to expand...

Just to be clear:
I made the original comment about the gravestone and said, "Lets not start etching the gravestone". I couldn't tell from your response whether you noticed the all important "not" in my reply. Like you I was trying to put people's fears to rest. But since you made the same points that I did I can see we are in agreement.

Richard, you make an excellent point about the emulation of Xbox originals on the 360. But I think that since we know access to Live and PSN will be fully transferable from this generation to the next there is reason to believe that all content associated with Live and PSN will be transferable as well.

I think Farsight just needs to have a better process for managing the console releases. It's known to everyone that the console makers are pickier about approving downloads than the mobile people are, and have all sorts of special rules; right or wrong, it's a fact of life. Making sure the XBLA and PS* releases are (in Farsight's absolute best estimation) up to MS and Sony's specific standards, or that any necessary variances have been negotiated, before the title updates and DLC actually get submitted, probably has to be somebody's full-time job, if it isn't already. They can't afford to have them take these month-long bounces.

I know how hard this kind of thing is for a small developer; it may be that staffing is the problem. But if that's the case, then they need to scale back their expectations for what they can do.

It's obviously not out of a lack of interest in console releases. Pinball Hall of Fame was a product for game machines, and we know some developers at Farsight consider the XBox 360 their main reference platform. But they need to get it right.

PiN WiZ said:

When the new consoles come out, I expect FarSight to release The Pinball Arcade 2 with more realistic graphics and physics. They should be able to keep making new tables and upgrading the tables from The Pinball Arcade without having to rebuild them from the ground up. They can release the upgraded TPA tables in bulk packs at a discounted price.

Click to expand...

I'll gladly spend $60 for a console version of the game with updated graphics and physics, new tables, all current tables, Twilight Zone, Star Trek TNG, Adams Family and a few others. They can call it Ultra Pinball Arcade to differentiate itself. However it has to be substantially better, with night mode, much better lighting effects, and clearly more advanced textures. I will not be rebuying everything for a lazy port, like what they have done with the 3ds PBHOF which is released as if they never took a look at the final build.

PinHead4Life said:

Just to be clear:
Richard, you make an excellent point about the emulation of Xbox originals on the 360. But I think that since we know access to Live and PSN will be fully transferable from this generation to the next there is reason to believe that all content associated with Live and PSN will be transferable as well.

Click to expand...

I'd be shocked if Microsoft at least didn't make all content playable on the next machine. The reason they had to emulate backwards compatibility on the 360 was that they didn't own the graphics hardware made for the original XBox so it could not be incorporated into the graphics solution for the 360. From what I've read and heard, they didn't make the same mistake here and own the rights to all of the GPU and CPU hardware in the 360 so they can incorporate that into the design of the next machine to support hardware backwards compatibility.

i too am inclined to think, that xbox720 (or whatever it'll be called), will have at least full xbla compatibility...

besides, they're pluggin in xbla in windows8, so all is not bleak... yet

I'm not worried. I think Farsight is doing alright in sales, and they're smart enough to adapt to future consoles when the time comes.

Even you have to rebuy all tables combined 60 euro for a new console. Why is that a big problem? Many games cost 60 euro, and have 10 hours max playtime and no replay value.

Why is it a problem to buy ''pinball arcade 2'' on new consoles? You can play if for years to come. When you look at playtime, pinball arcade is one of the cheapest games made, ever...

Every new generation rebuy the game, i dont think its a problem at all. Or do you guys still want a free copy of fifa 2012 for ps3 cause you bought fifa 98 for ps1?

Worrying over 60 euro extra costs in a ''might happen'' case, just relax, everything wil be fine.

Sony is not likely to pull the plug on the ps3 when the next console comes out just as they supported the ps2 for years after the ps3 was released. FS can probably likely make dlc for the ps3 for the next 4 years at least.

All this Next gen talk began the day after the Ps3 released, seriously. In this economy , with the big 3 console manufacturers hitting all time LOWS in profits. Bonus cuts, CEOs taking salary cuts, ect. The time to introduce a another wave of NExt generation hardware is FAR AWAY . The tepid successs of the Vita is evidence of it. The Wii U , was also panned by many at E3 this year. The rumours of NG machines that dont allow used games also P.o.d alot of prospective buyers , and gettting them back wont be easy . Sony PS3 and 360 are here to stay until the economies of Japan and North America dramatically get better.