Williams' Collection Volume 4 guesses

shutyertrap · Mar 27, 2019

shogun00 said:
Occasionally! I still prefer TPA's lighting effects over Zen's.

Do you mean the controllable aspect of it? Because while I like that feature, the overall lighting is much better in Zen. Light actually fills in a 3 dimensional space rather than in a flat plain like TPA. The light actually interacts with the ball too. There also aren't questionable lighting choices like FarSight would do, where something would be lit despite no light source, or how the insert light underneath the ball sometimes would show on the top reflection of the ball. Also all the inserts are legible in FX3, no blown out light blobs.

Fungi · Mar 27, 2019

Tiger Multiball aside, I also never felt the need to change the ball skin in ZEN just so I could see it.

Pete · Mar 27, 2019

I still need to buy the new 3 pack (have played TOM on the android a little) been spending all my money on snes/genesis pinball games to do live streams in the near future but thats a whole other story... but of the 7 tables ive played NO i can never go back. It really pains me to say that, really love TPA. The ball on Zen just moves so much better and feels more real. ...however like i recently did with fish tales if i want to figure out what all the rules are i open up TPA and learn them on that.

Citizen · Mar 27, 2019

You should get a Super Famicom and a JP Mega Drive and stream the Japanese exclusive pinball games too.

Pete · Mar 28, 2019

Couldnt possibly not do Battle Pinball for super famicom

all snes/genesis carts work on the american system with some easy mods, genesis you just either take the case off the top or cut the slot a little, same with snes. No japanese genesis pinball exclisives but the one mega drive pal one has me a little stumped, psycho pinball, some pal games work on ntsc and some dont so im crossing my fingers. If worse comes to worse ill change the header of the rom and run it off an everdrive, but i really prefer having and showing the real thing being used. Im even making a pinball controller for genesis by soldering arcade buttons to a controller pcb. Got my multicam setup working great even s-video moded my genesis for the best capture. Also my snes is circuit bent like crazy to do all kinds of glitches and fun stuff. Im insane about circuit bending things. Gonna start early in april, ill let you guys on here know.

Burdette25159 · Mar 28, 2019

CV
Hurricane
Big Guns

sh4wnsm1th · Mar 28, 2019

trash80 said:
Honest question... does anyone here choose to play the TPA version of a table over the Zen version after playing both? I have compared each table back to back and side by side multiple times, and there is not a single instance that I'd ever choose the TPA table over the Zen one. I've had loads of fun with the TPA tables in the past, but it is now difficult for me to enjoy the tables in TPA that Zen hasn't even done yet. I'll still play a few of the EM tables in TPA as the physics and presentation continue to feel and look fine for the slower play-style, but anything else I'll just quit after a quick ball or two.

Nope, even though Zen kicks my ass, I still prefer it to TPA, at least now. Balls are too floaty on TPA, whereas it feels real with Zen.

shogun00 · Mar 28, 2019

shutyertrap said:
Do you mean the controllable aspect of it?

Yes! I like to darken the room light and up the ambient.

FWIW, I'm also able to adjust real quickly between TPA and PFX3 physics.

1adam12 · Mar 28, 2019

While the Zen tables are more pleasing to the eye, I've found myself playing TPA much more.

I played a LOT of pinball when I was younger, and the TPA physics are more realistic in many cases.

I've tried Zen on my Android and iPad. There's something wrong with their physics I can't quite put words to. The tables feel dead. The gravity is weird, and the ball often seems to decelerate for no apparent reason. There is no consistency that I can feel.

I know I'm in the minority, but I've played a handful of TPA tables IRL, and they feel true to what I remember.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

shogun00 · Mar 28, 2019

1adam12 said:
I've tried Zen on my Android and iPad. There's something wrong with their physics I can't quite put words to. The tables feel dead. The gravity is weird, and the ball often seems to decelerate for no apparent reason. There is no consistency that I can feel.

That explains it. The mobile version is default to casual physics and you need to unlock the arcade physics.

If you have a decent PC or a modern game console (PS4, XB1, or Switch), then give Fish Tales (it's free) on Pinball FX 3 a try. Just start a "classic single player" game and give it a go.

1adam12 · Mar 28, 2019

shogun00 said:
That explains it. The mobile version is default to casual physics and you need to unlock the arcade physics.

If you have a decent PC or a modern game console (PS4, XB1, or Switch), then give Fish Tales (it's free) on Pinball FX 3 a try. Just start a "classic single player" game and give it a go.

I don't have any of those things so I'll have to wait it out a while. Being broke ain't fun.

On the other hand, I never particularly enjoyed Fish Tales. I'd still like a glimpse at the physics everyone is raving about. The mobile experience has been beyond terrible, but for a variety of reasons.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

Pete · Mar 28, 2019

Never was all too big a fan of fish tales either. I can get into tables even if i dont like the theme, but on fish tales i dont like the theme or layout. Probably wasnt the best choice for the free example table as not many people do like it. I think fish tales would actually turn allot of people off from williams tables if thats all they ever played. Should have made high speed or white water the free one. Im buying them all so not trying to get a free table i like, just think they should have picked one that was a better example for other people.

Nomorestalker · Mar 28, 2019

If a zen table exists I can't go back to the TPA version. I'd go back to the TPA app a lot more if they'd let me keep the resolution for Noex's camera mod but having to reset that every single time is a drag.

MBeeching · Mar 28, 2019

trash80 said:
Honest question... does anyone here choose to play the TPA version of a table over the Zen version after playing both?

I tend to play the TPA versions on my laptop and FX3 on my desktop. The Zen Williams tables are too demanding on an Intel HD 520, I wish they'd allow users to disable or reduce some of the intensive visual effects (reflections/shadows).

wilbers · Mar 28, 2019

MBeeching said:
I tend to play the TPA versions on my laptop and FX3 on my desktop. The Zen Williams tables are too demanding on an Intel HD 520, I wish they'd allow users to disable or reduce some of the intensive visual effects (reflections/shadows).

As well as turning off all the graphics settings you can, have you tried a lower resolution than your laptop screen to see if that helps enough?

MBeeching · Mar 28, 2019

wilbers said:
As well as turning off all the graphics settings you can, have you tried a lower resolution than your laptop screen to see if that helps enough?

I use 1600x900 (native: 3200x1800) with settings on minimum, it's ugly compared to FX2 which ran at 60fps with native resolution.
The biggest problem with FX3 is extreme frame rate variance, some tables run at 60+ FPS yet others are as low as 25 which is a huge performance margin.

Dropping to 1280x720 doesn't improve the frame rate on these problematic tables, the gains are minimal which suggests the GPU is struggling to render specific visual effects. I've scoured those tables I'm utterly convinced it's due to dynamic shadows and reflection complexity.

Those effects are implemented differently for each table, for example: Fish Tales with Zen's visual effects runs 20% faster than standard as there are no dynamic reflections in the side blades. Whereas Dr Strange has candles which constantly require shadow updates below the flags.

pahumaran · Mar 29, 2019

I hope....
Cirqus Voltaire
Tales of the Arabian Nights
Monster Bash

Byte · Mar 31, 2019

Whatever you want to call it (I call it "anything you can do, we can do better. We can do anything better than you" syndrome), I'm REALLY REALLY REALLY hoping to see at least ONE great table that wasn't released in TPA before. Not just on Zen, also on FS for not releasing anything for a long time. Just want a NEW table to play.

kimkom · Apr 1, 2019

I think Cirqus Voltaire will still probably be the AAA table.

I'd love to see White Water also included in Volume 4 to really make it a big hitting pack but I think Zen will go for No Good Gofers.

I'm keen to see what's in store for the first licensed tables. I still think Judge Dredd will be one of the first, and I think there's a chance Twilight Zone may also be released during the summer months.

I hope Zen continue to refine the platform on Steam by adding features such as customizable table parts, custom cameras and a better balancing of table music levels etc.

Would be nice to see the de-syncing audio issue completely banished too.

kimkom · Apr 1, 2019

Having said that... and given the timing, maybe we'll see Indianapolis 500 mid/late May

Williams' Collection Volume 4 guesses

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