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  Click here to go to the first FarSight post in this thread.   Thread: Zen Studios alters classic pinball art to protect family-friendly rating

  1. #76
    Moderator shutyertrap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I looked at the image before reading the post and my brain didn't register the edit as being a pre-teen girl, so it didn't seem creepy to me. Just censored. Perspective, I guess.
    I’m also saying that from the perspective of having seen the short film for years one way and then suddenly having it presented in this altered manner.

  2. #77
    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don7395 View Post
    Zen Studios alters classic pinball art to protect family-friendly rating

    https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/...r-esrb-rating/
    Don't you like it when they update the post and bury said update in the middle of the article?

    Kirk noted that Zen Studios has been penalized for inadvertently crossing the ESRB in the past. Last year, the studio's Infinite Minigolf was removed from digital storefronts after some inappropriate placeholder artwork accidentally made its way into the VR version of the game. The ESRB raised the game's rating to a T, requiring it to be altered and resubmitted to the ESRB before it could go back on sale at the original E rating.

    "We've been penalized ourselves by the ESRB previously," he said. "We made some mistakes. We can't afford to be caught again."
    And there's your answer on why they are censoring.

    I completely forgot about that incident with Infinite Minigolf last year.

    https://www.kotaku.com.au/2017/08/sw...tings-problem/

  3. #78
    Senior Member Spork98765's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun00 View Post
    And there's your answer on why they are censoring.

    I completely forgot about that incident with Infinite Minigolf last year.

    https://www.kotaku.com.au/2017/08/sw...tings-problem/
    That's a bit misleading when you read the updates on the story: https://kotaku.com/switch-game-pulle...lem-1798515928


    The story says the Xbox One and PS4 versions were rated T and the Switch needed to be changed for an E rating. Yet, the ESRB link shows the entire game on PS4 and Xbox One is now rated E by the ESRB. So does that mean the assets were changed retroactively on all versions, or just the switch?

    If it was just the switch, and then the rating across the whole game changed there is no good reason to change the art on Williams tables when there is a precedent for releasing differently rated DLCs on different platforms.

    This is entirely of Zen's creation due to them not bothering to add content descriptors, or by not bothering to properly rate their DLC additions.

  4. #79
    Senior Member SilverBalls's Avatar
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    From what I remember of seeing the Brady Bunch in the UK when I was very young, the man had 3 boys and the woman had 3 girls. That tells me that the bed never got much use as they never produced any kids together. I guess they were two knackered bringing up six kids. Not really relevant to the conversation but it just occurred to me almost 42 years after watching it - lol.

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    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spork98765 View Post
    The story says the Xbox One and PS4 versions were rated T and the Switch needed to be changed for an E rating. Yet, the ESRB link shows the entire game on PS4 and Xbox One is now rated E by the ESRB. So does that mean the assets were changed retroactively on all versions, or just the switch?
    They removed the questionable image from all versions. The PS4 and Xbox One versions got a patch to remove the image.

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    I'm totally in support of this. I mean if you think about it, right? 100 billion people die from lung cancer or end up being perverts or killers because of pinball artwork every single year. That means that you reading this are either dead, killed someone or you're going to have overly perverted thoughts.

    How did we as a culture survive swimsuit clad girls since the '50s, tobacco use for hundreds of years and fighting with a sword for over a thousand years?

    (sarcasm meter about to explode)

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    Senior Pigeon Kolchak357's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maneki1972 View Post
    I'm totally in support of this. I mean if you think about it, right? 100 billion people die from lung cancer or end up being perverts or killers because of pinball artwork every single year. That means that you reading this are either dead, killed someone or you're going to have overly perverted thoughts.

    How did we as a culture survive swimsuit clad girls since the '50s, tobacco use for hundreds of years and fighting with a sword for over a thousand years?

    (sarcasm meter about to explode)
    But I haven't killed anyone today. And let's face it, most pinball junkies were perverts long before they started playing pinball.

  8. #83
    Moderator shutyertrap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kolchak357 View Post
    But I haven't killed anyone today. And let's face it, most pinball junkies were perverts long before they started playing pinball.
    Who doesn’t remember walking past After Burner, hanging a right at Dragons Lair, and then going through the curtains between TMNT and Zaxon to play pinball? I think it’s where the video stores got the idea from for the ‘adult’ section.

    Kidding aside, when I went to Arcade Expo a few years back they actually did have a room with a curtain that had Sopranos, Big Bang Bar, and 2 others I can’t recall in it. The curtain was mainly because the room was lit with a black light and that was rather cool. But yes, the machines also had full adult modes going on with Sopranos dropping f-boms left and right.

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    Senior Member bavelb's Avatar
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    Compare that to yesterday, where I was playing in a public arade with tons of kids around, on an Elvira and the Partymonsters where the backglass was...let's say ....adjusted (link minus the black rectangle).

    Can't outdutch the Dutch I guess
    Last edited by bavelb; 10-25-2018 at 08:34 AM.
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    Moderator shutyertrap's Avatar
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    Well clearly Elvira doesn’t need anyone’s support 😂😂😂

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    Senior Member Citizen's Avatar
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    https://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/09/pi...esent-villain/

    We may all be villains. I mean, syt definitely is.

    (I wanted to just post a YT of that Sideshow Bob quote, but I couldn't find it.)

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    Meh, for the art no censorship would be better but bottom line is for some of this, their hands are tied. Now as to the rules, change one rule then you better not release the table at all. I can accept the art but the gameplay is sacrilegious and should in no way be modified.

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    Don't get me wrong: I would prefer uncensored tables as well, but you can hardly blame ZEN for restrictions set by Disney or ESRB.
    I do hope they find a way to solve this by making a special 16+ DLC or whatever solution they can find. Though I'll end up purchasing the tables anyway.
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  14. #89
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    Hi All - Mel from Zen here.

    We are going to have a big update on this topic in the near future. We thank the community for the continued feedback. It's great for us to have such clear understanding of what you want and expect from us.

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    Senior Member Pinballwiz45b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinball_chaos View Post
    Hi All - Mel from Zen here.

    We are going to have a big update on this topic in the near future. We thank the community for the continued feedback. It's great for us to have such clear understanding of what you want and expect from us.
    OH?

    I await this news, good or bad.

    But yeah, as long as 99% of the art is untouched and 100% of the rules remain intact, I'm fine.

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    Senior Member bavelb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinball_chaos View Post
    Hi All - Mel from Zen here.

    We are going to have a big update on this topic in the near future. We thank the community for the continued feedback. It's great for us to have such clear understanding of what you want and expect from us.
    Hey Mel, nice to hear from you through this less formal channel. Got to say, after playing some real life Junk Yard and Medieval Madness his week, I'm even more impressed than I already was (played Fish Tales as well, but the RL table had some weird-ass flippers so I couldn't compare). Looking forward to these future updates.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bavelb View Post
    Hey Mel, nice to hear from you through this less formal channel. Got to say, after playing some real life Junk Yard and Medieval Madness his week, I'm even more impressed than I already was (played Fish Tales as well, but the RL table had some weird-ass flippers so I couldn't compare). Looking forward to these future updates.
    Thank you. It will only get better from here.

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    Senior Member Citizen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinball_chaos View Post
    Hi All - Mel from Zen here.

    We are going to have a big update on this topic in the near future. We thank the community for the continued feedback. It's great for us to have such clear understanding of what you want and expect from us.
    Thanks Mel, looking forward to it.

    It's great how well-informed you guys keep fans.

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    Senior Pigeon Kolchak357's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinballwiz45b View Post
    OH?

    I await this news, good or bad.

    But yeah, as long as 99% of the art is untouched and 100% of the rules remain intact, I'm fine.
    Kind of how I feel as well. It’s fine as long as I don’t notice.

  20. #95
    Senior Member Blkthorne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinball_chaos View Post
    Hi All - Mel from Zen here.

    We are going to have a big update on this topic in the near future. We thank the community for the continued feedback. It's great for us to have such clear understanding of what you want and expect from us.
    Really enjoying the tables and certainly appreciate the work Zen has done on them, just hopeful that a solution can be found on the censorship front and no removal of game modes.

  21. #96
    Senior Member kinggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bavelb View Post
    Hey Mel, nice to hear from you through this less formal channel. Got to say, after playing some real life Junk Yard and Medieval Madness his week, I'm even more impressed than I already was (played Fish Tales as well, but the RL table had some weird-ass flippers so I couldn't compare). Looking forward to these future updates.
    IMO, the most formal way is just like this, on the actual community board with people that are most interested in the product. I get that those don't generate most of the sales but they do understand what the product is about and how it should look/work while the rest of the buyers will just buy it. Or not. For whatever reason often not related to product as such but some reason that they can't exactly explain.
    Dear FS, Special Force and Radical, please.

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    Senior Member Pinballwiz45b's Avatar
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    Blahcade had the interview with Mel earlier today. Looking forward to hearing what's going on in about 2 weeks' time.

    Anyway, I recently remembered another game and wanted to share this, regarding the cigars/tobacco portion of the censorship, specifically. Yeah, it's a minor detail, but Pinball FX3 (and as Jeff Strong also mentioned, Heroes of the Storm) is not the only game to have had tobacco references removed.

    Back when Bejeweled 3 was almost finished with development, PopCap originally intended to have Zen mode include things to break bad habits -- before then, it contained "helping players quit smoking". Guess who intervened -- the ESRB. If they left it in, Bejeweled 3 would've been a T-rating right then and there.

    Because Fish Tales is free, that table is immediately available to players, and the original art would be rated by the ESRB.

  23. #98
    Senior Member wolfson's Avatar
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    get use to it , this is Zen , they aren`t Farsight . I have never had any problems with Zen

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    Senior Member Silverball67's Avatar
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    I really hate our present time of censorship and fu***** political correctness so much.
    Wish I had a time-machine-travel to the 70´s!

    I wonder why many RAP-Songs have very exclusive rights (rap*** women, ki***** cops..., no Problem, part of a special, worth protecting "culture"?). Most Kids "enjoy" these garbage, but bikini-ladies and a Smoking fisherman in pinball got to be censored? Very strange and rediculous.
    Last edited by Silverball67; 10-31-2018 at 05:26 AM.

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    With Zen and Farsight, it seems their attitude is the same as some peoples attitude to planning permission when unsure if its needed or not. Zen does it the right way and checks what is needed in advance, and hence are sustainable in the long term. Farsight ploughs on thinking "well it will probably be OK", and deals with any issues later when it isn't.

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