Manufacturer Rundown

[JoshuaKadmon]

I've also often equated pinball to golf or auto racing. You can always improve your basic skills, whether that's your golf swing, apex cornering, or flipper passes; but just as you must learn the nuances of each individual golf course or race track, you cannot master pinball until you've learned the intricacies of the individual tables. That's the kind of thing that makes people obsess over competition, the one thing that could drive a mainstream pinball market again if people finally understood that pinball was more than flipping a ball randomly away from a hole...

 

[laughing_lunatic]

the one thing that could drive a mainstream pinball market again if people finally understood that pinball was more than flipping a ball randomly away from a hole...

Unfortunately, as far as "mainstream" is concerned, pinball IS doing a flipper frenzy, both flippers at the same time, just whacking away hoping that "something" happens, a dinging bell, or flashing light and watch the sheer panic should they "accidentally" start a multi-ball. A friend of mine, a very casual pinball fan, was over the other night, so I fired up TPA and we played us some ToTAN. Watching me, she actually commented about how bored she was getting watching me play, as I shot, trapped, controlled, did post passes, nudged etc... she played and I have to be honest, it was great to watch her as she had just SOOO much fun just wailing away, I was kinda jealous that I now take my pinball games so seriously...

Anyway, getting to my point, she MUCH prefers FX2. She likes the animations and cool table themes. She also likes that the flipper gaps smaller and the monstrously long ball saves. That's where the "mainstream" is for video pinball, I think. Sims like TPA are, and always will be, a niche market. The tables are TOUGH ! Mainstreamers wouldn't have either the patience or the inclination to put in the hours of playing over and over to get to grips with the idiosyncrasies of the tables, refine flipper techniques which are essential to getting far into a table, practice severity and timing of nudges, have the patience to stack modes etc. They want to mong out on the flippers and have something sparkly, loud and cool to happen. Soon and often.

 

[JoshuaKadmon]

Unfortunately, as far as "mainstream" is concerned, pinball IS doing a flipper frenzy, both flippers at the same time, just whacking away hoping that "something" happens, a dinging bell, or flashing light and watch the sheer panic should they "accidentally" start a multi-ball. A friend of mine, a very casual pinball fan, was over the other night, so I fired up TPA and we played us some ToTAN. Watching me, she actually commented about how bored she was getting watching me play, as I shot, trapped, controlled, did post passes, nudged etc... she played and I have to be honest, it was great to watch her as she had just SOOO much fun just wailing away, I was kinda jealous that I now take my pinball games so seriously...

Anyway, getting to my point, she MUCH prefers FX2. She likes the animations and cool table themes. She also likes that the flipper gaps smaller and the monstrously long ball saves. That's where the "mainstream" is for video pinball, I think. Sims like TPA are, and always will be, a niche market. The tables are TOUGH ! Mainstreamers wouldn't have either the patience or the inclination to put in the hours of playing over and over to get to grips with the idiosyncrasies of the tables, refine flipper techniques which are essential to getting far into a table, practice severity and timing of nudges, have the patience to stack modes etc. They want to mong out on the flippers and have something sparkly, loud and cool to happen. Soon and often.

I think that's an accurate assessment of "mainstream" interest. I just hope that, in the process of gaining mainstream interest with digitally realized games like FX2, we will re-energize the more hardcore players and allow them an opening for more serious competition. I believe that may contribute to the current phenomenon of new pinball manufacturers, PAPA conceptualizing televised tournaments, etc. All we need is for enough mainstreamers to care about pinball to pay attention, even if watching a real competitor bores half of them to tears. For the other half, the skill level and techniques involved may elevate their thinking on the subject. I've seen plenty of my casual pinball friends get more obsessed with it after TPA and me encouraging them to play real tables, as they started to understand the complexity of the game.

That being said, some people will definitely still prefer the lower difficulty and fast-paced excitement of digitally realized tables. I personally can't stand FX2, as it epitomizes the reasons video game pinball always felt like a bastardization to me. I love playing video games, especially RPGs like Mass Effect, Shin Megami Tensei, and Demon's Souls, but TPA was a huge exception to what I expect out of both video games and digital pinball. Normally, I don't think a video game is worth my time unless I can sink 60+ hours into an immersive world and customizable characters. And typically, if I wanted to get a true pinball experience, I would settle for nothing less than the real thing. TPA managed to overcome both hang-ups.

 

[BonzoGonzo]

if 'mainstream' interest could be summed up in a sentence or two it would be something like this "i want to press a button and win. if i payed for the product that means i should be able to do so without much stress. i want an exciting story to boot. also, there should be a big explosion at the end"



and the sad part is, that this mentality is not so far from the truth at all

 

[JoshuaKadmon]

if 'mainstream' interest could be summed up in a sentence or two it would be something like this "i want to press a button and win. if i payed for the product that means i should be able to do so without much stress. i want an exciting story to boot. also, there should be a big explosion at the end"



and the sad part is, that this mentality is not so far from the truth at all

All correct, and in addition to pinball, I think the same mainstream mentality is what has ruined video games, movies, music, television, and pretty much every other entertainment medium in the last decade.

By the way, I forgot to list Hankin as a noteworthy manufacturer.

 

[laughing_lunatic]

I think the same mainstream mentality is what has ruined video games, movies, music, television, and pretty much every other entertainment medium in the last decade.

I don't think it's ruined entertainment at all. It's most certainly dominated it, because it's profitable. Take movies for instance, I don't know what the actual figures are, but I'm willing to bet that whatever Micheal Bay bang-boom-ratatatatat blockbuster is playing in screen 1, it's outselling the latest Lars Von Trier mindf*** in screen 2 by orders of magnitude, although Von Trier is CLEARLY the better film maker (a true genius of cinema IMO. He and Bergman should be mentioned in the same breath, no question), Bay gives the public what they want. Stare at a screen, switch off the brain and ohhh and ahhhh at the bigness of it all. And that's the difference. Bay makes movies, Von Trier creates cinema. But Bay doing his thing hasn't ruined the medium, it's simply exploited it for all the $$$ it can get.

People leave "Transformers: Dark of the Moon" saying "dooooood, awesomeness, totally awesome..." People leave "Antichrist" saying "what....whh.... what TF DID I just watch ???" Awesomidity will always outsell having to think.

 

[BonzoGonzo]

yeah lars is kewl

i especially liked idioterne... and that series that was going on in the hospital was not bad at all... what was it called, riget?

about the switching off the brain part... why not just get intoxicated with the poison of your choice instead of watching a 'blockbuster'? those just seem to piss me off 99.99% of the time, lol

hm this is getting offtopic fast

 

[JoshuaKadmon]

Well, just to bring the discussion full-circle and back on topic, I've at least noticed that Sonic and Zaccaria released many of their tables in America, as I have several of their flyers to which I hadn't given much thought. But Unidesa, Maquinas, and some of the others, I'm not so sure about.

Is anyone clear on where the Game Plan licenses went once the company went under?

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

Found something!

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=497004&showall=1
theres a video if you scroll down.

 

[JoshuaKadmon]

That's pretty slick. I wanna play.

 

[SKILL_SHOT]

Im a gear head I DIG the billet pistons and rat fink von dutch vibe.