The William's Pinball Hall of Fame VS The Pinball Arcade Graphic Comparisons

[bonch]

what did you use for waxing? shoe polish?


This is the real table:

It looks almost the same as the phof version, again compare the drawing of the princess.

A picture taken a few feet away with a camera flash will certainly be brighter. However, pinball tables have historically been played in dim arcades and bars, accentuating the lighting effects of the playfield. In a static comparison, the brighter image may look more appealing because you're studying the artwork, but when in motion with animated lights, a darker table really stands out.

In fact, when I play the iOS version of Arabian Nights, I sometimes have trouble tracking fast movement of the ball because of the bright ambient light level causing the details of the artwork to blend in with the chrome ball.

 

[PiN WiZ]

My two cents is that being able to see the playfield artwork is nice, but adds nothing to the gameplay experience while playing a table in a dimly lit room allows for the light show on the tables to greatly enhance the experience of the actual gameplay. This is the same effect you would get playing a table with the sound low or with it cranked up. Again, just my personal opinion.

 

[spoonman]

Here's a pic where the flash doesn't wash out the lighting effects

This is about the type of lighting I'm used to at the old arcades:

 

[Fungi]

Wow, that top pic is just a wonderland isn't it? Actually, it reminds me of what PS3 Funhouse looks like right now.

 

[spoonman]

This is awesome news from Bobby King (Farsight)...

Question:
In terms of lighting, are there any plans for adding "day" and "night" modes?

BK:
Yes, we are planning to add day and night mode lighting. Currently on mobile, this would require twice the textures for each table and we don’t have the bandwidth in our art staff to do this for every table at the moment. Our goal is to support real-time lighting on all platforms. before we go back and re-visit this. I envision a slider on the Table Menu so you can select where you prefer the lighting between

It's a very welcome option IMO.

 

[Franky]

However, pinball tables have historically been played in dim arcades and bars

that's wrong, just because you've played them in the dark doesn't make it historically.

sometimes have trouble tracking fast movement of the ball because of the bright ambient light level

that makes no sense to me, cause the darker the playfield the harder it is to see the ball


But once again, i really enjoy the light show but it's not the real table than. and thinking of building a cabinet, if the cabinet mode is that dark (like in the top picture of the arcade) i personally not gonna build one - to expansive for having a cabinet where it's hard to see the ball.

@ PiN WiZ
if a nice playfield adds nothing to the gameplay experience, than i feel really sorry for you. And you can't compare picture and sound - these are two complete different stimuli. But as you've said - it's a personal preference. but in doubt always the original first.

Once again, i don't talk about playing in broad daylight but in an correctly lit environment. Here is an example of a perfectly lit environment for playing pinball:

but let's just sit and wait if the day and night mod will come.

Franky

 

[bavelb]

Why do you keep arguing about what they should make the table brighter than they are, when FS have already stated they will make a lighting slider to adjust for all tastes?

Most people prefer the light shows in darker environments, others like to look at the art in the playfield in lighter conditions. There is no use in arguing tastes, so why bother?

 

[brakel]

I don't see any reason to continue to argue about this. Some people like a bright environment and some people like a darker environment to play in. You aren't going to convince someone that they're wrong. No one is wrong in this argument. There's just what people like.

 

[bonch]

that's wrong, just because you've played them in the dark doesn't make it historically.

Well, arcades traditionally had dim lighting. I think it's the intended environment for most modern pinball tables. It's what I prefer, anyway.

that makes no sense to me, cause the darker the playfield the harder it is to see the ball

The chrome effect on the ball reflects the bright lights around it, making it stand out when moving across the dark play field. I sometimes lose track of a fast-moving ball on iOS tables with complicated artwork. Play fields in real life are easier to make out regardless of lighting due to depth perception and other factors that are lost in Pinball Arcade, so I just find that a darker play field helps with that.

 

[Fungi]

I'm right there with ya Bonch.

 

[spoonman]

Well, arcades traditionally had dim lighting. I think it's the intended environment for most modern pinball tables. It's what I prefer, anyway.

The chrome effect on the ball reflects the bright lights around it, making it stand out when moving across the dark play field. I sometimes lose track of a fast-moving ball on iOS tables with complicated artwork. Play fields in real life are easier to make out regardless of lighting due to depth perception and other factors that are lost in Pinball Arcade, so I just find that a darker play field helps with that.

I agree. Every arcade I have been in since the 70's has been dimly lit. Though I have seen a few later arcades 2004+ that were well lit.. Then they disappeared shortly after.. A coincidence?!

I don't see any reason to continue to argue about this. Some people like a bright environment and some people like a darker environment to play in. You aren't going to convince someone that they're wrong. No one is wrong in this argument. There's just what people like.

Or even better, we could get back on topic! WPHOF vs TPA

 

[shutyertrap]

When it was in it's original location, the Pinball Museum in Vegas (aka the PBHoF) actually operated in day and night mode. They had large storefront windows that let in the natural light, so seeing the playfields in all their glory while playing happened. Once night though, they didn't bother with any overhead lights and it was a completely different experience. I think being able to play under both those conditions was awesome.

The new location however doesn't offer this, only dimly lit arcadey goodness.

 

[Fungi]

The new location however doesn't offer this, only dimly lit arcadey goodness.

Well, the last time I went there was in its old location. I went specifically to play Pinball Circus. Unfortunately, they had it in the window and I was there during the day. The glare made it impossible to play. I'm glad to hear about the dimly lit arcadey goodness.

 

[shutyertrap]

The new location is pretty grungy. I got there before opening and couldn't even tell if it was still an operating business, that's how derelict the building looks! Inside they no longer had the isles organized by manufacturer which made it difficult to find machines I wanted to play, but did promote playing tables I otherwise wouldn't have given two looks at. It kinda feels like you stumbled into some guys garage with the concrete floors, tables that are being restored, and general state of grunge. Completely the opposite of how I imagine PAPA must be.

 

[Fungi]

Ew. Really? That's kinda heart breaking.

 

[brakel]

I didn't think it was grungy at all, just utilitarian. It wasn't dirty. The building is a very non-descript cinder block building and the floor is concrete. But it has hundreds of pinball tables! What more do you need?

 

[shutyertrap]

Correct, not dirty. But the other location at least had a certain presentation factor to it, seemed organized. Now there was 2 isles of games roped off for repair and my 6 year old didn't wanna leave my side!

 

[brakel]

Correct, not dirty. But the other location at least had a certain presentation factor to it, seemed organized. Now there was 2 isles of games roped off for repair and my 6 year old didn't wanna leave my side!

Maybe it has changed since I was last last there, but when you came in the door on the left (as you look at the building from the front parking lot), all of the games to be played were directly in front and to the right of the door. The area to the left of the door as you walked in and all the way to the back wall was where they had their parts machines and where they would do repairs that could not be done on the floor.

I thought it was cool that you could see the old parts machines and works in progress. A little messy looking sure but this is pinball not a casino. I liked the stripped down, just pinball look of the place. A good contrast from the fake veneer of the rest of the city.

I hope you also understand the mission of the Pinball Hall of Fame. The founder made his money in arcades in Michigan when arcades were popular. Sold out at the right time and took his personal collection to Nevada to retire. Eventually he decided to share his collection with people in the area. It became too difficult to do this at his home and eventually he opened the PHoF in Vegas. All of the money collected in the machines pays for the building, electricity, etc. The rest of the money each month is donated to the Las Vegas Salvation Army. I'm not really a religious person so I don't really care that much about them supporting a church but the Salvation Army does a lot to help the homeless population of Las Vegas and there is a huge homeless population there.

So, I think he purposefully doesn't spend money on making the place "look nice" but just keeps the place as a simple building to keep the pinball machines happy and playing.

 

[shutyertrap]

I was there in April of this year. Yeah, walked in the door and straight in front of me was arcade cabinets and a few pins that were in various states of repair, and then went clear to the back. Turn head to the right and there's the magic. We probably saw the same thing, it just stood out in sharp contrast to when I had been to the old location (only a week after it officially opened no less. Made a special trip I did!)

I love what the Pinball Hall of Fame stands for. Had a nice long discussion with the ponytailed guy in glasses (name escapes me). My understanding was they had gotten a non profit grant that was sustainable, especially if they could get their own building. I'm guessing with the new place, they did just that. At that time, there wasn't a single Stern table in the place, and he said that those tables would put the grant in jeopardy, something to do with Stern being an active company. Also, he didn't like new tables for a 'museum'! That obviously changed too, as I saw at least 10 of their tables, all in the front row.

Another big change was all tables used to be $.25, with only Pinball Circus costing a dollar. This time I played a lot of $.50 tables, regardless of their age. But hey, if that's what it costs to keep the place running, more power to them. I also love how on a lot of the machines there'll be a little card telling of the uniqueness of a particular table, or even if it's been newly shopped like the Funhouse they had there. I was overjoyed that I got to play Cactus Canyon (though in my excitement I completely forgot how to play it from my days of playing in VP), bummed I didn't try out Champion Pub (we were in a rush), and happy to finally get my hands on the G'n'R table, despite how much I hate Data East.

And yeah, his personal collection is apparently 1000 tables strong, in some wharehouse where a bunch of collectors used to meet up and play on occasion. That's where the idea came, to share with the public, cause they realized how unique pinball had become and how rare it was to actually get to play. All I know is if I lived in Vegas, I wouldn't have a gambling habit that was draining my wallet, cause that place would have it all instead! 3 1/2 hour drive is plenty of buffer, but close enough to scratch the itch if it's truly driving my nuts.