Will Farsight allow us to transfer our tables to the PS4 version when the time comes?

[shutyertrap]

Of course they're going to charge for the PS4 versions, just like they charged for the updated PHOF tables in TPA (and those were on the SAME platforms). It's the only way they can make major updates and still stay afloat as a business. I'm not sure how we could expect them to put that much work in for free.

*sigh*

Quit saying FREE!!!

Nobody, and I mean nobody expects upgrades for free. C'mon Jeff, psuedokings just posted that very thing, as did I in front of his post!

Also, of course there was a charge from PHOF to TPA, 'cause how would they even know we owned the disc? Digital store is what makes this happen.

Finally, there is a big difference in rebuying the what, 24 tables available from both PHOF (not sure, as I didn't bother with the Gotlieb), and rebuying the 42 there will be come next gen.

DISCOUNT. That's what is being argued for. There have been multiple examples provided in this thread of it being done. Now, argue accordingly!

 

[smbhax]

Of course they're going to charge for the PS4 versions, just like they charged for the updated PHOF tables in TPA (and those were on the SAME platforms). It's the only way they can make major updates and still stay afloat as a business. I'm not sure how we could expect them to put that much work in for free.

Just to play devil's advocate here, the PS3 PHoF was disc-based, so they didn't have PSN id purchase records to track it who had already bought those tables. ; )

Also, the tables were completely rebuilt--I think?--and they might not have to do that for the existing TPA tables going to the PS4, aside from having to completely revamp the lighting.

And I would expect them to charge something for the base program, just like they did for TPA on PS3.

In any case, I won't be one of those who will claim to be "outraged" if they *don't* carry table purchases over. It would be nice if they did, but sort of understandable if they don't. And it isn't as though they ever promised they would--indeed, their silence on the subject would incline one to assume they won't.

 

[shutyertrap]

Seriously though, this is gonna be a mess. The more I read about it, the more I can sense an explosion coming. Look at us here, people already getting a little worked up over a pinball game. Some kids (and adults) revolve their whole lives around PS3 games. Better close the door to the basement, Mom, there's gonna be a ragesplosion.

Yep, a mess for a whole host of games, not just us in our little pinball ecosystem. We haven't even heard what Microsoft is planning, and people are already raging about them!

Don't know how many times or ways I can say it, but we're in a different place now with regards to digital entertainment.

 

[smbhax]

I'm guessing the jump from TPA to TPA 2 (or whatever it's going to be called on next gen consoles)

This is an interesting point; given that they've only ever referred to the PS4 version by the same name--"The Pinball Arcade"--I was taking that to indicate that they'd just keep the name the same, and treat this as yet another platform. It would be simpler that way, and after all they'll still be bringing new table releases to the platforms they already support... Hm. Well I suppose if they do like completely overhaul the physics and graphics and so forth for all platforms that would make sense, but they haven't indicated they'll be doing that. Yet!

 

[shutyertrap]

In any case, I won't be one of those who will claim to be "outraged" if they *don't* carry table purchases over. It would be nice if they did, but sort of understandable if they don't. And it isn't as though they ever promised they would--indeed, their silence on the subject would incline one to assume they won't.

Agreed. I just wish to make informed purchasing decisions.

 

[Jeff Strong]

*sigh*

Quit saying FREE!!!

Nobody, and I mean nobody expects upgrades for free. C'mon Jeff, psuedokings just posted that very thing, as did I in front of his post!

Also, of course there was a charge from PHOF to TPA, 'cause how would they even know we owned the disc? Digital store is what makes this happen.

Finally, there is a big difference in rebuying the what, 24 tables available from both PHOF (not sure, as I didn't bother with the Gotlieb), and rebuying the 42 there will be come next gen.

DISCOUNT. That's what is being argued for. There have been multiple examples provided in this thread of it being done. Now, argue accordingly!

Sorry, I admit I haven't read every post in this thread, so I was replying to the OP...

BTW, I do think you're wrong in saying "nobody expects upgrades for free". A TON of people whined on the FB page when they realized they had to buy PHOF tables again. That's what I had in mind when I brought up PHOF...

Even if PHOF was digital, I'm pretty sure Farsight would've charged full price for TPA. Maybe they would've offered a discount, but I doubt it.

 

[smbhax]

I tend to think a discount scheme is unlikely, simply because it's a lot more complicated to set up something like that--or at least, it has seemed that way from what I've seen the current PSN store.

 

[DrainoBraino]

Yeah, but this isn't Zen...and they didn't completely overhaul the graphics on the older tables in Zen 2.

I'm guessing the jump from TPA to TPA 2 (or whatever it's going to be called on next gen consoles) is going to be a bigger jump than PHOF to TPA, so the price should be worth the extra pennies per table.

Yea, they did overhaul the graphics and physics on the old tables. Just sayin...

Yep, a mess for a whole host of games, not just us in our little pinball ecosystem. We haven't even heard what Microsoft is planning, and people are already raging about them!

Don't know how many times or ways I can say it, but we're in a different place now with regards to digital entertainment.

A different place indeed. I'm scared.

 

[Heretic]

All debate and too little play makes ermm jack a dull boy

Ok it soudned better in my head

I domt see an issue ifmthe next gen features are worth buying thrn upgrade

It does seem the only future proof option as far as features are concerned will be pc.

I say buy for the devices you use regularly multiple copies if you like for various platforms

If hte newer features dint appeal why worry?

Are anyone but fanboys and early adoptors gonna worry about the ps4 for a few years anyway?

If you can afford that, paying for the advanced tables shouldnt make a dint in the pocket.

If the pc version isnt superior to the ios version im every way i may just stick with ios umtil it is lol

I dunno

 

[Jeff Strong]

Yea, they did overhaul the graphics and physics on the old tables. Just sayin...

I said they didn't completely overhaul the graphics. They updated them, but what Farsight is planning for the PS4 is much different...a complete overhaul of their graphics and lighting engine.

 

[PiN WiZ]

Zen only optimized the older tables to run on their new engine which also in turn made the tables look a bit better due to the way the new engine rendered them. Zen did not overhaul any of the older tables. Also, many of you are ignoring the fact that both Zen Pinball and Zen Pinball 2 run on the same hardware.

 

[Byte]

I will be happy to re-purchase for PS4 if it makes a big difference. I play FS games on PS2, PSP, Wii and PS3 and they are all separate purchases, without complaint/question.

With big difference I mean physics, lighting, graphics and engine. Wouldn't it be cool that instead of moving up and down and zooming in, the camera would actually change angle? Sometimes even viewing from a slight angle would make it look so much more real.

Have a look at some of the YouTube table videos, look at the lights on the table, they dim on and off, and your can see a bright spot where the bulb is, etc.

How about, and that is to draw in the younger crowd, to do what is done in racing games; after great shots do slo-mos of the ball, etc ( optionally of course! )

 

[Metalzoic]

I have the perfect solution. Instead of calling it The Pinball Arcade, they can name it: The Pinball Arcade 2: Electric Boogaloo
Boom! New product, new purchase, no entitlement.


What would it being digital even have to do with it? It doesn't matter if it's on disc, digital or a holographic potato. It's simply a content delivery medium, it doesn't change what content you agreed to have access to playing with your purchase.

 

[Jeff Strong]

What would it being digital even have to do with it? It doesn't matter if it's on disc, digital or a holographic potato. It's simply a content delivery medium, it doesn't change what content you agreed to have access to playing with your purchase.

Excellent point.

 

[shutyertrap]

I have the perfect solution. Instead of calling it The Pinball Arcade, they can name it: The Pinball Arcade 2: Electric Boogaloo
Boom! New product, new purchase, no entitlement.


What would it being digital even have to do with it? It doesn't matter if it's on disc, digital or a holographic potato. It's simply a content delivery medium, it doesn't change what content you agreed to have access to playing with your purchase.

Here's why digital matters. People now have 'digital libraries' of content, whether it be games or movies or books or music. You buy an e book through Amazon, you can either use your Kindle or download the app and use whatever tablet you want. Same goes for music. Movies used to be restricted, but now with cloud services like UltraViolet, no more.

Do you understand the mindset the public has about digital media use? I've said this over and over again, it's the psychology behind it.

So, while games have always been restricted to the console you purchased for, the line has started to get blurred. Can we agree on that? Cross play with PS3 and Vita, DSi titles allowed to play on 3DS machines, PSN purchases of PS1 games playing on PSP, Vita, and PS3, iTunes store purchases playing on iPhone or iPad so long as same user name. I get that the PS4 is a completely different beast from the PS3, but the line has been blurred, and it is because of digital.

The delivery of content has changed, so has the attitude toward that content. That attitude might be completely wrong, and yes sometimes it leads to feelings of entitlement. Denying that there is a change though, that's just turning a blind eye to reality.

To be clear, and let's steer away from this, I am NOT arguing that FarSight owes us, I am not asking for free upgrades. I am arguing the possibility of a discount being made available, and the reasons why that DOES make sense to think about. I'm also saying that coming out now and making it clear that it won't be a possibility is BETTER than not saying anything at all, at least in terms of how people will feel about the goings on with future FarSight purchasing habits.

 

[PiN WiZ]

To be clear, and let's steer away from this, I am NOT arguing that FarSight owes us, I am not asking for free upgrades. I am arguing the possibility of a discount being made available, and the reasons why that DOES make sense to think about. I'm also saying that coming out now and making it clear that it won't be a possibility is BETTER than not saying anything at all, at least in terms of how people will feel about the goings on with future FarSight purchasing habits.

One question...If you purchase and download the theatrical release of a movie online and then say a year later, the movie company decides to release a director's cut of the same movie, would you expect an option to purchase the director's cut at a discounted price since you already purchased the theatrical release?

 

[pinbot-76]

If I can play PS4 in full HD then I'll think about it. If we have to keep playing on low resolution to make up for flipper lag then there is no point to upgrade.

Director's cut would include more content. Doubt that a simple TPA port will include much that is new. C'mon we all know these things aren't going to be rebuilt from the ground up.

 

[Tron]

C'mon we all know these things aren't going to be rebuilt from the ground up.

Bingo. A sprinkle of jazzdust and a tinker with the engine is all it'll get and thank you very much that'll be $9.99 all over again.

 

[Tabe]

One question...If you purchase and download the theatrical release of a movie online and then say a year later, the movie company decides to release a director's cut of the same movie, would you expect an option to purchase the director's cut at a discounted price since you already purchased the theatrical release?

If you bought a movie from PSN to play on your PS3, would you expect to be able to play it on your PS4?

 

[brakel]

Did you know that according to TPA's EULA
1) we don't own the program or app called TPA or the DLC, we just have purchased a license to use it
2) we can only use TPA and its DLC on one device concurrently. Never mind what Sony lets you do, which is to install it on two devices concurrently, when you download TPA you are agreeing to only use it on one device.