Is there or is there not a reasonable chance to get The Addams Family?

[brakel]

I think it's along the lines of say if some company purchased the rights to Bally/Midway (like premier did Gottlieb) and all their assets, they might not have a problem re-releasing the table as it's already been agreed that Bally/Midway could create pinball tables with his likeness, and that he himself had no issue with said pins being made (or it was part of his contract when making the movie or something).

TPA, even though it's a recreation, it's a derivative work based on the pinball table. And that is where it gets dodgy. They aren't reproducing the actual table but making a digital version of it. The transition from celluloid to blu-ray, is a conversion of the movie, but not an alteration. It's taking the original print and the original movie, and not changing things. If someone (else since it was actually already done, but with different actors) were to create a new movie using say digitally edited footage (like they did with Brandon Lee with the Crow), assuming they have it, it would be an entirely different ball-game, unless of course, they got Raul Julia to sign off on it beforehand.

Whether it is his estate or not that is the hold-up is all speculation as it is, and we will probably not hear a word from FS as to what the hold-up is either so as not to sour any potential negotiations.

Right. It's the same as movies and TV shows made before home video (VHS, DVD, BD, streaming) became a normal part of the release schedule, the studios had to go back and negotiate the home video release with the actors in those movies. Once the home video market became part of the regular release schedule then the studios built that into the contract that the actors signed before they filmed the movie. Some contracts even cover multiple derivative works like action figures or other toys for appropriate movies but I doubt that any movie contract has covered virtual recreations of pinball machines!

 

[vikingerik]

What would stop Williams and Farsight from coming to an agreement on Addams that leaves out Raul Julia?

I know it's been said that the Williams contract requires TPA to render the tables in their original form. But that's not some cosmic law of physics requirement, that's just WMS's opinion. Could they agree on a reworking to work around Julia's estate? Or does something constrain that, like did the original licensing stipulate that the game couldn't be reproduced without one or more of the actors?

I'm not saying those parties would necessarily want to, but wondering why they haven't or can't.

 

[Bruttus]

The Addams Family is a historically important machine, not only because it's the best-selling pinball machine of all time, but because its progressing rule structure vastly influenced all other pinball machines made after it. There was nothing nearly as complex, yet easy to understand, that came before it. That's why I feel it should be on The Pinball Arcade. (As well as its sheer recognizability. Ask someone on the street to name a pinball machine, and chances are they will answer with The Addams Family.)

It's the same deal as how Super Mario Bros. isn't really that great nowadays, as better-designed platforming games had come out since, but it's undeniable the impact it had on the genre and on video games as a whole, and anyone who seriously thinking about preserving notable video games MUST include Super Mario Bros.

FarSight has said many times (and we've since repeated it many times in numerous threads) that the biggest issue with Addams Family that they are having is getting the various license owners to even pick up the phone. When FS says they've made progress, I believe that to mean someone finally answered! I doubt Paramount is the issue, and I actually think the Addams estate is the one being more difficult than Raul's.

As for the question of "what's the big deal with...", that can be said about any table someone has never seen nor played in person. Talk to anybody that was around the pinball scene in the 90's, they'll say TAF should be in TPA. I doubt there is any other table yet to be released that would get such a universal answer. So just trust those that know. It's not the second coming, and there are probably going to be other tables you actually like better, but it is a table that stands the test of time and is in an over abundantly large amount of collector's homes.

Well said by both of you. While I agree that TAF has historical importance with its innovative gameplay which can be appreciated by hardcore pinballers and collectors alike, the popularity of TAF stems from two basic reasons..... It is a fun pinball machine to play and has a very high replay value. I have played my share of old and new pins, and while by no means do I consider myself hardcore I feel the combination of overall gameplay and theme concept has and will stand the test of time. It should no doubt be a part of TPA provided that the licensing issues can be resolved.

I know there are alot of layers involved with the licensing, but there is something to be said in that FS is looking to use Julia's likeness and voice from a pre-existing pin and simply putting it in digital form. As long as the re-creation stays as accurate to the original without any creative liberties, it should alleviate any concerns of ruining the reputation of Julia, as been mentioned in previous posts as a big potential issue.

Hopefully we will hear soon one way or the other.

 

[brakel]

What would stop Williams and Farsight from coming to an agreement on Addams that leaves out Raul Julia?

I know it's been said that the Williams contract requires TPA to render the tables in their original form. But that's not some cosmic law of physics requirement, that's just WMS's opinion. Could they agree on a reworking to work around Julia's estate? Or does something constrain that, like did the original licensing stipulate that the game couldn't be reproduced without one or more of the actors?

I'm not saying those parties would necessarily want to, but wondering why they haven't or can't.

For one thing Raul Julia's estate might not be the issue. It might be the Addams estate or any number of others. Second, why would someone want a recreation of the Addams Family pinball machine that's not the Addams Family pinball machine?

But really, as outsiders, we have no idea what the issues are to getting the licensing done so guessing at solutions to made up problems is quite silly.

 

[vikingerik]

Because Addams minus Julia is still better than no Addams at all.

I'm explicitly trying NOT to guess here, asking if anyone had any actual information or insight on that topic.

 

[brakel]

Because Addams minus Julia is still better than no Addams at all.

I'm explicitly trying NOT to guess here, asking if anyone had any actual information or insight on that topic.

Well, then that's easy. No. No one here knows.

An Addams Family pinball with the principal actor from the movie ripped out would be worse than no Addams Family pinball in TPA. If it's not a true reproduction then it is not a reproduction at all.

 

[danivempire]

Well the idea of an addams pinball without gomez addams is just...
...
A bad idea...
...

 

[superballs]

It would be funny as hell though if they just replaced the samples with the Addams Family cartoon voice actor and replaced him on the backglass with the cartoon version from the 90s spinoff.

That's of course assuming the Julia Theory (can we just start calling it that?) is true. It is the most popular reasoning it seems, even I tend to fall into thinking of it as more than just speculation sometimes, even though I know full well that there are many potential reasons.

What I do know is that Farsight would likely be over the moon if they could release it so it's not their lack of desire.

 

[Biff]

Well FS confirmed the Julia issue on Facebook .. not saying that it is the only issue.
But think about "Back to the Future", there is no Michael J. Fox on the backglass .. just a "look-alike" .. and it worked more or less. And the playfield design & the rules of a machine are more important than the theme, correct? So, what we need is a look- and sound-alike.

 

[Bruttus]

Well FS confirmed the Julia issue on Facebook .. not saying that it is the only issue.
But think about "Back to the Future", there is no Michael J. Fox on the backglass .. just a "look-alike" .. and it worked more or less. And the playfield design & the rules of a machine are more important than the theme, correct? So, what we need is a look- and sound-alike.

While that might speed up getting TAF to TPA, if it is the major reason for the holdup in the first place, the table just wouldn't feel right IMO. It would be like replacing a primary actor in a sequel or changing an original band member on a subsequent album. (Dare I say Van Halen?)

 

[Zombie Aladdin]

FarSight has said many times (and we've since repeated it many times in numerous threads) that the biggest issue with Addams Family that they are having is getting the various license owners to even pick up the phone. When FS says they've made progress, I believe that to mean someone finally answered! I doubt Paramount is the issue, and I actually think the Addams estate is the one being more difficult than Raul's.

What about MGM? Then again, as MGM went under and was recently revived, it's probably in a beggars-can't-be-choosers situation.

I didn't even think about the Addams estate having issues with the table. However, considering that Charles Addams himself disapproved of many of the peripheral Addams Family stuff (he disliked how the family members were made sympathetic--if you look at the New Yorker comics, they are very mean-spirited and cruel), if the family wanted to respect his wishes, there would have been no Addams Family movies, no Addams Family cartoon, and certainly no Addams Family pinball machine, at least without changes so big as to make the characters highly unsympathetic and thus the stories unwatchable. Hence, I doubt the Addams estate is the issue here (perhaps besides difficulty in contacting).

Well FS confirmed the Julia issue on Facebook .. not saying that it is the only issue.
But think about "Back to the Future", there is no Michael J. Fox on the backglass .. just a "look-alike" .. and it worked more or less. And the playfield design & the rules of a machine are more important than the theme, correct? So, what we need is a look- and sound-alike.

As mentioned above, part of the Williams contract (wasn't The Addams Family under the Bally brand?) is that the virtual tables must be as much like the original machines as they can, and that includes accurate artwork. With the case of Back to the Future, Michael J. Fox refused to let his likeness be on the pinball machine, so the artists at Data East drew Marty to look like someone else entirely, or at least enough to make it clear to Fox that it isn't him.

In other words, the Julia issue arises AFTER the machine with his likeness had been released, and the Fox issue arose BEFORE the machine intended to have his likeless was released.

 

[Kratos3]

How about we create an Addam's Family section of the forum?

 

[netizen]

How about we create an Addam's Family section of the forum?

or a never ending speculation/request thread that each new member has to post at least 5 requests for TAF in before they can post in any other section of the forum.

 

[shutyertrap]

How about we create an Addam's Family section of the forum?

Okay, that's funny enough that I'm gonna bring it up with the other moderators!

 

[Biff]

As mentioned above, part of the Williams contract (wasn't The Addams Family under the Bally brand?) is that the virtual tables must be as much like the original machines as they can, and that includes accurate artwork. With the case of Back to the Future, Michael J. Fox refused to let his likeness be on the pinball machine, so the artists at Data East drew Marty to look like someone else entirely, or at least enough to make it clear to Fox that it isn't him.

In other words, the Julia issue arises AFTER the machine with his likeness had been released, and the Fox issue arose BEFORE the machine intended to have his likeless was released.

I know that, but CoTBL doesn't have two audio tracks because of licensing and on CV they use a slightly different Ringmaster that wasn't on the production tables. Few things seem to be negotiable and Julias last wish is a good argument.

 

[danivempire]

you want a way for the "addams family request" post stops?
release addams family on tpa.

 

[Biff]

you want a way for the "addams family request" post stops?
release addams family on tpa.

But then this forum will be flooded with "realease Indiana Jones" posts ...

 

[LeRoy3rd]

^Bwahahaha!

 

[lettuce]

Lol, what are we going to do with our self's when/if The Addams Family get released on TPA???................start on Simpsons, Indiana Jones or Tron i guess

 

[Bowflex]

Lol, what are we going to do with our self's when/if The Addams Family get released on TPA???................start on Simpsons, Indiana Jones or Tron i guess

The one good thing about knowing there is a less than 1% chance that any Disney associated properties will ever get made is that there is no point in even making noise about it.
The bad thing is that 99% of the people out there don't know this and will continue to make requests every 3 hours without looking at any previous posts.